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Lipomo · 10.11.2024, 19:39

Hi

First, I'm using the experimental version 2024-11-05. When I encode my FFV1 video, color matrix BT 709 (which seems to be detected by Hybrid), the resulting encodings have different colors, as if it was converted from BT 601 to BT 709.

Here is the video sample : Google drive

And when I close Hybrid I have this message :

<HybridData name="defaultContainer" value="mkv"/>

and

<HybridData name="defaultContainer" value="mp4"/>

differ.

<HybridData name="mkvColorMatrix" value="BT709"/>

and

<HybridData name="mkvColorMatrix" value="GBR"/>

differ.

<HybridData name="mkvColorRange" value="Broadcast Range"/>

and

<HybridData name="mkvColorRange" value="Unspecified"/>

differ.

<HybridData name="mkvColorTransferCharacteristics" value="Unspecified"/>

and

<HybridData name="mkvColorTransferCharacteristics" value="Reserved"/>

differ.

<HybridData name="mkvColourPrimaries" value="Unspecified"/>

and

<HybridData name="mkvColourPrimaries" value="Reserved"/>

differ.

<HybridData name="mkvMaxContentLight"/>

and

<HybridData name="mkvMaxContentLight" value="1000"/>

differ.

<HybridData name="mkvMaxLuminance" value="0"/>

and

<HybridData name="mkvMaxLuminance" value="1000"/>

differ.

<HybridData name="mkvMinLuminance" value="0"/>

and

<HybridData name="mkvMinLuminance" value="1e-04"/>

differ.

Note that i have reinstalled Hybrid from scratch.

***Selur*** · (This post was last modified: 10.11.2024, 19:58 by Selur.)

According to media info your source has no vui info:

Video

Count                                    : 393

Count of stream of this kind             : 1

Kind of stream                           : Video

Kind of stream                           : Video

Stream identifier                        : 0

StreamOrder                              : 0

ID                                       : 1

ID                                       : 1

Unique ID                                : 1

Format                                   : FFV1

Format                                   : FFV1

Commercial name                          : FFV1

Format version                           : Version 3.4

Format settings, Slice count             : 4

Format settings, Slice count             : 4 slices per frame

Codec ID                                 : V_MS/VFW/FOURCC / FFV1

Codec ID/Url                             : http://ffdshow-tryout.sourceforge.net/

Duration                                 : 658032.000000

Duration                                 : 10 min 58 s

Duration                                 : 10 min 58 s 32 ms

Duration                                 : 10 min 58 s

Duration                                 : 00:10:58.032

Duration                                 : 00:10:57:09

Duration                                 : 00:10:58.032 (00:10:57:09)

Bit rate mode                            : VBR

Bit rate mode                            : Variable

Bit rate                                 : 129969013

Bit rate                                 : 130 Mb/s

Width                                    : 1920

Width                                    : 1 920 pixels

Height                                   : 1080

Height                                   : 1 080 pixels

Pixel aspect ratio                       : 1.000

Display aspect ratio                     : 1.778

Display aspect ratio                     : 16:9

Frame rate mode                          : CFR

Frame rate mode                          : Constant

Frame rate                               : 23.976

Frame rate                               : 23.976 (24000/1001) FPS

FrameRate_Num                            : 24000

FrameRate_Den                            : 1001

Frame count                              : 15777

Color space                              : YUV

Chroma subsampling                       : 4:2:0

Chroma subsampling                       : 4:2:0

Bit depth                                : 8

Bit depth                                : 8 bits

Scan type                                : Progressive

Scan type                                : Progressive

Compression mode                         : Lossless

Compression mode                         : Lossless

Bits/(Pixel*Frame)                       : 2.614

Delay                                    : 0

Delay                                    : 00:00:00.000

Delay                                    : 00:00:00:00

Delay                                    : 00:00:00.000 (00:00:00:00)

Delay, origin                            : Container

Delay, origin                            : Container

Stream size                              : 10690487944

Stream size                              : 9.96 GiB

Stream size                              : 10 GiB

Stream size                              : 10.0 GiB

Stream size                              : 9.96 GiB

Stream size                              : 9.956 GiB

Writing library                          : FFV1 YUV 420 8-bit

Writing library                          : FFV1 YUV 420 8-bit

Default                                  : Yes

Default                                  : Yes

Forced                                   : No

Forced                                   : No

coder_type                               : Range Coder

MaxSlicesCount                           : 4

ErrorDetectionType                       : Per slice

So Hybrid guesses the color matrix based on the resolution.
You can set the color matrix value of the mkv container under "Config->MKV tagging->VUI->Matroska advanced video signaling".

Quote: And when I close Hybrid I have this message :

This happens if you tell Hybrid to:
a. overwrite the defaults on closing
b. report changes to the config
So, to me, it looks like you asked for this.

Cu Selur

Ps.: Depending on what filtering you applied, color changes can also happen due to filtering.

Lipomo · 10.11.2024, 20:30

Quote:So Hybrid guesses the color matrix based on the resolution.
You can set the color matrix value of the mkv container under "Config->MKV tagging->VUI->Matroska advanced video signaling".

Regarding color matrix info on media info, yes you're right, but that's just because I cut that sample with a software that removes them. I have the issue with the full video that have all matrix infos.

Question : Since Hybrid guesses color matrix based on resolution, why did it changed colors since the video is 1920x1080 so BT.709 to BT.709 ?

Quote:And when I close Hybrid I have this message :
This happens if you tell Hybrid to:
a. overwrite the defaults on closing
b. report changes to the config
So, to me, it looks like you asked for this.

I checked all warnings, but I don't think I checked any option that overwrite settings. I always save them manually.

Where is that option to save settings on close just to make sure it's disabled ?

Also, why does it say GBR while the source is BT.709 ?

Here is the media info from the raw file :

General

Unique ID                  : 283324640147748610621348756177095046601 (0xD526574192ECD5480C1D8D725BCD35C9)

Complete name              : G:\Davinci Resolve\099.mkv

Format                      : Matroska

Format version              : Version 4

File size                  : 5.03 GiB

Duration                    : 6 min 28 s

Overall bit rate mode      : Variable

Overall bit rate            : 111 Mb/s

Frame rate                  : 23.976 FPS

Encoded date                : 2024-11-09 16:31:33 UTC

Writing application        : Blackmagic Design DaVinci Resolve Studio

Writing library            : Lavf58.45.100

ErrorDetectionType          : Per level 1

Time code of first frame    : 00:00:00:00

Time code source            : Matroska tags

Video

ID                          : 1

Format                      : FFV1

Format version              : Version 3.4

Format settings, Slice coun : 4 slices per frame

Codec ID                    : V_MS/VFW/FOURCC / FFV1

Duration                    : 6 min 28 s

Bit rate mode              : Variable

Bit rate                    : 109 Mb/s

Width                      : 1 920 pixels

Height                      : 1 080 pixels

Display aspect ratio        : 16:9

Frame rate mode            : Constant

Frame rate                  : 23.976 (24000/1001) FPS

Color space                : YUV

Chroma subsampling          : 4:2:0

Bit depth                  : 8 bits

Scan type                  : Progressive

Compression mode            : Lossless

Bits/(Pixel*Frame)          : 2.194

Stream size                : 4.93 GiB (98%)

Writing library            : FFV1 YUV 420 8-bit

Default                    : Yes

Forced                      : No

Color range                : Limited

Color primaries            : BT.709

Transfer characteristics    : BT.709

Matrix coefficients        : BT.709

coder_type                  : Range Coder

ErrorDetectionType          : Per slice

Quote:Ps.: Depending on what filtering you applied, color changes can also happen due to filtering.

I though about that so I tried without any filtering and the issue remains.

***Selur*** · 10.11.2024, 20:46

Quote:Since Hybrid guesses color matrix based on resolution, why did it changed colors since the video is 1920x1080 so BT.709 to BT.709 ?

Since you chose to ignore the sticky and provie details on how to reproduce the problem I can only guess.
If no RGB<>YUV conversion takes place color matrix does not matter.
If you do apply filtering, check the generated scripts to see whether something there seems wrong.
On playback RGB<>YUV conversion does take place so maybe the player of your choice it at fault.

Quote:Where is that option to save settings on close just to make sure it's disabled ?

"Config->Profiles->Auto save defaults"

Quote:Also, why does it say GBR while the source is BT.709 ?

Quote:<HybridData name="mkvColorMatrix" value="BT709"/>
and
<HybridData name="mkvColorMatrix" value="GBR"/>
differ.

Sounds like the value under "Config->MKV tagging->VUI->Matroska advanced video signaling" changed which do not matter if you haven't enabled the 'Matroska advanced video signaling'. No clue why the value before was GBR.

Going to bed soon, if you share proper details, I can try to find some time to look at it tomorrow after work.

Cu Selur

Lipomo · 10.11.2024, 20:57

Quote:Since you chose to ignore the sticky and provie details on how to reproduce the problem I can only guess.
If no RGB<>YUV conversion takes place color matrix does not matter.
If you do apply filtering, check the generated scripts to see whether something there seems wrong.
On playback RGB<>YUV conversion does take place so maybe the player of your choice it at fault.

No filtering applied. Not an RGB video. Just 4.2.0 to 4.2.0. Same result in all players and also virtualdub

Quote:"Config->Profiles->Auto save defaults"

Thank you, so yes it's disabled.

Quote:Sounds like the value under "Config->MKV tagging->VUI->Matroska advanced video signaling" changed which do not matter if you haven't enabled the 'Matroska advanced video signaling'. No clue why the value before was GBR.

I never enabled "Matroska advanced video signaling" so that's strange.

And btw, the "GBR" warning message on closing only appear when loading these sources encoded with Davinci Resolve.
Maybe I'll try to upload you the full 5Gb video so that you can try, if I don't find anything in the meantime.

Lipomo · 11.11.2024, 00:09

Here is the full video. I still can't fathom why Hybrid changes the color space

MEGA.NZ

***Selur*** · (This post was last modified: 11.11.2024, 06:24 by Selur.)

Without you sharing what you are actually doing with the source in Hybrid (debug output ?) I don't really know how to reproduce your problem.
Simply remuxing the file with Hybrid:

F:\Hybrid\64bit>MediaInfo.exe g:\color_change_099.mkv

General

Unique ID                                : 283324640147748610621348756177095046601 (0xD526574192ECD5480C1D8D725BCD35C9)

Complete name                            : g:\color_change_099.mkv

Format                                   : Matroska

Format version                           : Version 4

File size                                : 5.03 GiB

Duration                                 : 6 min 28 s

Overall bit rate mode                    : Variable

Overall bit rate                         : 111 Mb/s

Frame rate                               : 23.976 FPS

Encoded date                             : 2024-11-09 16:31:33 UTC

Writing application                      : Blackmagic Design DaVinci Resolve Studio

Writing library                          : Lavf58.45.100

ErrorDetectionType                       : Per level 1

Time code of first frame                 : 00:00:00:00

Time code source                         : Matroska tags

Video

ID                                       : 1

Format                                   : FFV1

Format version                           : Version 3.4

Format settings, Slice count             : 4 slices per frame

Codec ID                                 : V_MS/VFW/FOURCC / FFV1

Duration                                 : 6 min 28 s

Bit rate mode                            : Variable

Bit rate                                 : 109 Mb/s

Width                                    : 1 920 pixels

Height                                   : 1 080 pixels

Display aspect ratio                     : 16:9

Frame rate mode                          : Constant

Frame rate                               : 23.976 (24000/1001) FPS

Color space                              : YUV

Chroma subsampling                       : 4:2:0

Bit depth                                : 8 bits

Scan type                                : Progressive

Compression mode                         : Lossless

Bits/(Pixel*Frame)                       : 2.194

Stream size                              : 4.93 GiB (98%)

Writing library                          : FFV1 YUV 420 8-bit

Default                                  : Yes

Forced                                   : No

Color range                              : Limited

Color primaries                          : BT.709

Transfer characteristics                 : BT.709

Matrix coefficients                      : BT.709

coder_type                               : Range Coder

ErrorDetectionType                       : Per slice

F:\Hybrid\64bit>MediaInfo.exe g:\color_change_099_remuxed.mkv

General

Unique ID                                : 32266779443871545638779280747641669775 (0x18465B0D73571B5615C86DC92C53888F)

Complete name                            : g:\color_change_099_remuxed.mkv

Format                                   : Matroska

Format version                           : Version 4

File size                                : 5.03 GiB

Duration                                 : 6 min 28 s

Overall bit rate                         : 111 Mb/s

Frame rate                               : 23.976 FPS

Encoded date                             : 2024-11-11 04:21:23 UTC

Writing application                      : mkvmerge v88.0 ('All I Know') 64-bit

Writing library                          : libebml v1.4.5 + libmatroska v1.7.1

Encoding Gui                             : Hybrid 2024.11.10.1

Video

ID                                       : 1

Format                                   : FFV1

Codec ID                                 : V_MS/VFW/FOURCC / FFV1

Duration                                 : 6 min 28 s

Bit rate                                 : 111 Mb/s

Width                                    : 1 920 pixels

Height                                   : 1 080 pixels

Display aspect ratio                     : 16:9

Frame rate mode                          : Constant

Frame rate                               : 23.976 (24000/1001) FPS

Color space                              : YUV

Compression mode                         : Lossless

Bits/(Pixel*Frame)                       : 2.239

Stream size                              : 5.03 GiB (100%)

Default                                  : Yes

Forced                                   : Yes

Color range                              : Limited

Color primaries                          : BT.709

Transfer characteristics                 : BT.709

Matrix coefficients                      : BT.709

does not change the VUI meta data of the clip.

Cu Selur

Lipomo · 11.11.2024, 06:24

(11.11.2024, 06:16)Selur Wrote: Without you sharing what you are actually doing with the source in Hybrid (debug output ?) I don't really know how to reproduce your problem.

I'm not on my PC right now, but that's really simple :

- I open the video
- I set FFV1 codec with default value
- MKV container
- AddStart queue
- The output video has different colors

I checked the encoding script in the vapoursynth tab and it seems that the source is detected as matrix 709 and then set as 709 for the output well.

I could share you the debug file this evening if you don't found something in the meantime.

***Selur*** · 11.11.2024, 06:31

I will try to reproduce this after work.

***Selur*** · 11.11.2024, 06:32

Also try whether this problem is still present in the latest dev version (available in the 'experimental' folder of my GoogleDrive, linked on the download page).

Cu Selur

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